|
Post by motdaugrnds on May 14, 2019 20:37:32 GMT -5
A few years back I created a 6' x 30' raised bed. I dug the "great" soil out of an area in my garden about 2-1/2 ft down and piled a lot of fallen trees (trunks, limbs) as well as all sorts of left-over wood from construction projects in this hole. I also added what was not used from slaughtering meat animals for the family. Then I added the top soil back on top of it all and sprayed it down well with the garden hose so as to get as much of the soil as possible into all the crevices. Then I added greens from the garden and from mowing as well as several hundred bags of cheap top soil I purchased. (This bed was built up 2-1/2 ft from ground level with a frame I can sit on; so it needed a lot in it to get the soil as high as I wanted it.)
Then I planted root crops. It was a disaster! The local ag agent told me the bed was full of "wire" worms. His suggestion was to solar the top few inches and use a Bonide insecticide. I have not done so as yet but would like to do something. (I'm wanting to plant a fall garden here.) Sure would appreciate help with this....thanks.
|
|
dirtguy50
Pro Member
My avatar got in trouble for digging in the garden
Posts: 255
Zone:: 6b
Joined: February 2014
|
Post by dirtguy50 on May 14, 2019 22:08:30 GMT -5
OMG. I am totally speechless! Is this a real post?
|
|
|
Post by paquebot on May 14, 2019 22:58:28 GMT -5
OMG. I am totally speechless! Is this a real post? That post is real. I helped with original advice so am familiar with it from the start. Wireworms probably came with the original topsoil as they feed on roots. Normally they are a problem if the ground had been in sod or hay for a couple years. Tilling will eliminate a lot of them but that's a problem on a bed that's a couple feet aboveground. Could still be done with a spade if needed. But there is another light ahead. If the bed isn't goong to be used again until fall. spade or disturb the top 6" and don't allow any plants or weeds to grow all summer. If no food for the worms, they won't survive. In other words, starve them out. Martin
|
|
|
Post by octave1 on May 15, 2019 7:13:42 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by pepperhead212 on May 15, 2019 8:10:09 GMT -5
Beneficial nematodes have been used against wireworms, but I can't speek from experience, only what I have read.
|
|
|
Post by brownrexx on May 15, 2019 8:12:38 GMT -5
I wondered about a trap crop for wireworms and did a Google search. I found this:
Potatoes make great wireworm traps. Cut a potato in half and run a stick through the middle. Bury the spud about one inch deep so that the stick stands vertically as a handle. Pull the traps out after a day or two and discard wireworms.
Apply Beneficial Nematodes when planting to attack and destroy developing pests in the soil. One pint — 10 million active units — treats up to 550 square feet of planting area.
I also saw mention of cultivating the top 6-8" of soil and letting the birds help by eating the larvae that become exposed.
|
|
|
Post by paquebot on May 15, 2019 9:08:30 GMT -5
All good advice so far. True about their life cycle maybe longer than what you would like but the idea of starving them out needs more explanation. You won't find wire worms in ground that's been worked for a few years. Their defense against a food shortage is to shut down and pupate. When the beetles emerge, they head for places where there is a lot of food and that's usually sod. They won't lay eggs where there is nothing for their larva to eat. In ground that is infested with them, theory is that tilling once will destroy 90% of them. Tilling a second time kills 90% of the initial survivors. Sun and desiccation are their enemy. Expose them and they are done.
Martin
The truth is more important than the facts.
|
|
|
Post by motdaugrnds on May 15, 2019 21:56:41 GMT -5
Great information everyone. My bed is 180 sq ft that is 4.5 ft deep for a capacity (I think) of 810 cubic feet of soil space...if I'm understanding what my son just told me. Right now I'm getting poke salet and lambsquarter out of this bed; so I guess I actually feeding the wire worms. No removing all the top soil is not an option as I'm physically unable to do so...neither is my son. No I cannot get in this bed with a tiller; yes I can get in with a large-pronged rake...if my legs will hold out. (Knees aren't what they use to be.) The ag agent told me treating the top layer of this bed will not get rid of wire worms because they live deep in the bark/wood I placed in years ago. He did say it would kill the ones near the surface of the bed but the real problem is deeper. Please correct me if this is wrong: What I'm thinking of doing now is cut some Irish potatoes in half, run a stick thru them and bury them 1" into the soil...while my lambs quarter and poke salet is still providing me with greens. Later during hottest part of summer maybe pull all the vegetation out completely and cover soil with thick black garbage bags. Then maybe early September add some beneficial nematodes to the soil and plant a small fall garden in there. Pros? Cons?
|
|
|
Post by brownrexx on May 16, 2019 7:55:02 GMT -5
I am not an expert on wire worms but I read several articles written by entomologists and I didn't see anything about wireworms eating decaying material like the wood in the bottom of your bed. They all said that they eat roots and stems of plants especially grasses.
If it were me I would find a way to cultivate the top layer of soil to expose larvae to birds. It is also recommended to use a tool or shoes with spikes to poke holes in the surface soil to impale and kill larvae.
Potatoes on a stick can be used as a trap crop and then removed and thrown in the trash in 5-7 days.
It is also recommended to use full sized carrots with foliage as trap crops. Pull the carrots after a week and discard them.
I doubt that solarization will work since the larvae can just burrow deeper as the soil warms although maybe this could starve some of them.
|
|
|
Post by motdaugrnds on May 16, 2019 9:45:04 GMT -5
Ok thanks. You guys/gals are a great help.
|
|
|
Post by paquebot on May 16, 2019 10:34:09 GMT -5
Yes, Brown's got it. Ag agent is wrong about the wire worms living in the wood. They only eat living roots. That's why you won't find them very often in an established garden. Beetles won't lay their eggs where there isn't a steady supply of food and that's usually sod. I have not seen one since 2008 when the community garden added a half-acre which had been hay ground. Fall plowing got rid of most and disking and digging in the spring took care of more. Still were a few survivors but gone by the following year.
Martin
The truth is more important than the facts.
|
|
|
Post by motdaugrnds on May 17, 2019 15:01:40 GMT -5
Oh Martin and Brown you have certainly taken a load off my mind. Now I have hope that this bed can be useful to me. (A bit ticked at the ag agent as he would have had me laying solar sheeting and spraying with those terrible insecticides.) Thank you all so much.
|
|
|
Post by motdaugrnds on Jun 21, 2019 7:25:02 GMT -5
Updating.... I cut some Irish potatoes in half, poked a stick thru each and planted them about an inch in this raised bed. (I had to clear out a lot of the lambsquarter to have a place to do this.) In 3 days I pulled a potato up and saw nothing had damaged it. I put it back and waited another 3 days. Still no evidence of wire worms. I'm guessing they are enjoying the lambsquarter and poke salet that was still growing well there.
Now that my poke salet has started seeding, I will be pulling everything...absolutely all vegetation...out of this raised bed and then turning the soil well a few times. Only planting I'm considering this year is for fall crops of greens and peas; and that won't take place until after I've added some "beneficial" nematodes I've read about. Will let you all know how this comes out later this year.
|
|
|
Post by brownrexx on Jun 21, 2019 7:39:55 GMT -5
Thanks for the update. I always like to see how things work out for posters who had questions.
I would suggest trying the potatoes again after the greens are removed. It there are a lot of wireworms, they should head for the potatoes if there is nothing else for them to eat.
You could also plant a row of carrots and pull them after they get growing a bit. Carrots are also suggested as a trap crop and may be a good test to show you how many wireworms are in the soil if they become infested. Just don't let them grow too long or you will be providing a food source.
|
|
|
Post by paquebot on Jun 21, 2019 8:03:11 GMT -5
I'd suggest the opposite of what Browner said. Pull everything and not plant anything back. It would amount to starving them out. Their defense against having nothing to eat would be to pupate and become an adult beetle. Then they would vacate and not return. Adults will only lay eggs where there is sufficient permanent vegetation for their larva.
Martin
The truth is more important than the facts.
|
|
|
Post by brownrexx on Jun 21, 2019 8:07:24 GMT -5
I'd suggest the opposite of what Browner said Uh, oh what to do? paquebot , has more experience with wireworms than I do so I would go with his advice. However if it were me, I would try the potato again just to see if they are really there. The Ag agent is the one diagnosed the problem as wire worms and based on his other advice about them living in the logs, I am not sure that I would trust him. I need proof when I do things.
|
|
|
Post by paquebot on Jun 21, 2019 10:24:13 GMT -5
The opposite is to not plant anything. If nothing is growing there, it's two solid shots at them. First is to stop feeding them. Second is to avoid a new generation. The adults will only lay their eggs in existing vegetation. That's why they are so common in sod. For that reason, they are seldom a problem in existing gardens where there is no permanent food supply.
Martin
The truth is more important than the facts.
|
|
|
Post by paquebot on Jun 21, 2019 13:26:19 GMT -5
Browner, read your reply a couple times again to see if I misinterpreted something, as I have done before. Thought that it was clear that trap things don't work. Some are theoretic since if the worms are known to attack something, should if planted intentionally for them. The potato thing was not one of my suggestions for the simple reason that I've never actually heard of it working. All other methods are tried and true. That is tilling to disrupt them and eliminating their food source. As my bottom line says, the truth is more important than the facts. An Ag agent may preesent a lot of facts but it's truth that puts food on the table.
Martin
The truth is more important than the facts.
|
|
|
Post by brownrexx on Jun 21, 2019 15:21:13 GMT -5
paquebot, I totally agree with the methods that you suggested. I only suggested the potato or carrots to see if wireworms were present not as an alternative to tilling or starving them out. I read about it here. It is item #4 on the list www.planetnatural.com/pest-problem-solver/garden-pests/wireworm-control/I also saw several scientific papers where they made fermented grain traps to get a feel for the numbers of wireworms present in a field. They said that they are attracted to fermenting grains but I doubt that a home gardener would do this. The traps are not a method to eliminate the wireworms, just to get a feel for how numerous that are in a given area.
|
|